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Post by A.G. on Oct 29, 2015 21:57:49 GMT -5
Just curious, after pages and pages of posts about MGS5, did anybody change anyone's mind on the subject? It looks like after all the "evidence" everyone feels exactly as they did before. If you liked MGS5, good for you. But I don't think you will change anyone's mind. I guess some people are ok taking things in pieces. And certainly MGS5 has some nice pieces. But as a whole package it's a hard sell. The story is poor, character design and development is subpar, the world is empty, and the missions are repetitive. Mixed with the fact that the game is flat out not finished I don't see how this argument can move forward when this is the bottom line:
MGS fan or casual gamer, MGS5 is not a must-play game. There is nothing groundbreaking in it that must be experienced.
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Post by blackjaguar on Oct 29, 2015 22:55:02 GMT -5
Well I believe your negativity on anything after MGS4 is a factor on why you don't like it, you had no enthusiasm for the game to begin with or even with Peace Walker, which is fair enough, but it has clouded all the good aspects of this game for you.
I have wanted an open world Metal Gear since I saw the trailer for MGS3 for the first time and this has not disappointed.
I believe the freedom to complete the missions in any way you choose is groundbreaking and unique, My friends who are all playing it all have a different story than I do for every mission, and that is fantastic.
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Cerberus_0408
Elite (level 2)
Now playing MGS HD Collection and wanting Metal Gear Legacy Collection
Posts: 633
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Post by Cerberus_0408 on Oct 29, 2015 22:57:19 GMT -5
Yeah, well if you wanted an open-world game, look at Watchdogs, GTA or Saints Row. Those titles have SH!TLOADS of activities compared to PP.
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Post by blackjaguar on Oct 30, 2015 1:11:32 GMT -5
Yeah I'm sure they have alot but they are not the type of games I am after, Phantom Pain's open world is focused on what it should be focused on, open ended infiltration.
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fgdj2000
Elite (level 2)
Listen, don't obsess over words so much. Find the meaning behind the words, then decide.
Posts: 588 
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Post by fgdj2000 on Oct 30, 2015 2:38:39 GMT -5
I can only confirm what nlackjaguar says. Even though the game's story isn't as good as other Metal Gears, even though it is clearly incomplete it is by far one of the best stealth action games out there if not the best. And that is saying a lot about Kojima as a game designer. The mission targets may be reppetitive, but every single Metal Gear player has a unique experience with the game. You can tell stories about stuff that happened to you in missions. Even the cutscenes play out differently for every player. And Kojima was wise to not shoehorn a ton of side activities in the open world to compete with the likes of GTA or Assassin's Creed. And even though at first I tought missing NPCs would be a problem, they weren't. I'd rather have no NPCs than badly programmed ones.
And A.G. it is your anti-post-MGS4-Metal-Gear-bias that sadly hinders you from enjoying anything in the game. And that's just sad, because it doesn't get much better than this. Also, it seems to me, you've never seen the MG series as a game series, but as something between a movie series and a history and over that you completely disregard gameplay.
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Cerberus_0408
Elite (level 2)
Now playing MGS HD Collection and wanting Metal Gear Legacy Collection
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Post by Cerberus_0408 on Oct 30, 2015 6:53:01 GMT -5
I dunno bro... I mean, the SH!TLOADS of races, assassinations, drug deliveries, gang killing, criminal slaughter, car thefts... Sorry to crash your party, but nothing in this history of gaming can ever compare with the freedom you experience in Saints Row. saintsrow.wikia.com/wiki/Activities_and_Diversions_in_Saints_Row:_The_ThirdOne more thing. If Kojima did NOT add 'a ton of side activities', how the hell would one be able to farm resources/ personnel etc for their own motherbase as this was the case in PW? I mean, if that element of 'many, MANY side missions' was seen in Peace Walker and essentially bumped up the replay value, how could it make sense that said element was somehow missing from PP for whatever bullcrap reason Kojima provided? |
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Post by blackjaguar on Oct 30, 2015 17:47:28 GMT -5
My question to you is what extra things would you of wanted from an open world Metal Gear?? This game is not Saints Row or GTA of which I have no interest in those games at all, what would you have added to the open world which would actally benefit the game?
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Post by A.G. on Oct 30, 2015 23:49:19 GMT -5
First of all, I gave both MPW and MGS5 more than a fair chance. I don't dislike them simply because I feel they weren't necessary, I dislike them because they weren't well made. I don't grab a piece of something and use it as a way to justify the full package. I look at the whole package; gameplay, design, flow, characters, story, replay value, graphics, etc. And the reason I was a big fan of the series is because those games scored high in most, if not all categories. MPW and MGS5 didn't. The contradicting plots are just the icing on the cake. I look at other games the same way. To me, Uncharted 1 is just ok. The story and characters are great, but the gameplay suffers. Uncharted 3 is the reverse. The gameplay was good but the story and cast didn't click. Uncharted 2... Amazing game!
The point is that just because MGS5 has a handful of elements that are good doesn't make it a good game. Also, prior to MGS4, the series was a must play. It was better in so many ways than most of what was available at the time. But what is MGS5 best at? I just looked at Halo 5 and saw better facial animations. Look at GTA and you see a better open world experience. There are actually things to explore and do besides collecting materials. Even a lot of the stealth mechanics were already in the last Splinter Cell.
No, I'm not against MGS5 because I'm coming in with low expectations. I'm against it because OVERALL it's not a very good experience. I'm not going to praise a game that requires you to make excuses for it every other step. It was in development longer than any other MGS title, using an engine designed to make game design easier. The final product we got was incomplete, badly written, and frankly not that well put together. The number of things it got right is far overshadowed by the number of things it failed on.
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Cerberus_0408
Elite (level 2)
Now playing MGS HD Collection and wanting Metal Gear Legacy Collection
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Post by Cerberus_0408 on Oct 30, 2015 23:59:42 GMT -5
My question to you is what extra things would you of wanted from an open world Metal Gear?? This game is not Saints Row or GTA of which I have no interest in those games at all, what would you have added to the open world which would actally benefit the game? Well, since you ask... -MGS5 has MULTIPLE repetitive areas and the action is either spamming the tranqs or a firefight. Both of which were already OVERMILKED from the previous games. If you could at least control a farking Main Battle Tank, I would give Kojima the required respect. Hell, MGS4 gave you control of a bloody MG REX! -When you play for a while most guards wear armour and the gameplay gets real frustrating. I guess I can bitch and moan forever. But you get my gist. Kojima had MORE THAN ENOUGH TIME to make sh!t less repeated and this game IMO is just letting folks down. |
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Post by blackjaguar on Oct 31, 2015 1:29:21 GMT -5
Well there is alot more options than Tranking and straight out firefights not the games fault if you only use those as options. Its very rewarding experience to try and complete missions in different ways.
And you can use tanks what are you talking about. First Metal Gear boss battle where you can fight it with tanks. Still not buying your reasons completely AG but fair enough. There is a few things I wouldn't have minded differently but I'm happy with the game, alot more than when I first played MGS4.
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Cerberus_0408
Elite (level 2)
Now playing MGS HD Collection and wanting Metal Gear Legacy Collection
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Post by Cerberus_0408 on Oct 31, 2015 6:06:25 GMT -5
Your fanboy eyes, dude, blind you. The MGS5 areas are much bigger, but make no mistake; the action isn't. The paths between enemy outposts are huge yet very empty and barren. The first few times it's cool to ride a horse and enjoy the view, but then it gets old. And so do the enemy basis. With the exception of few, most are very similar. Look back at MGS3 and MGS4 where the maps are smaller, but much more developed. Also, both games had a good variation of environments. MGS3 had jungles, forests, swamps, mountains, caves, a fortress.. All 5 acts of MGS4 offered a very different setting and feel. In MGS5 there is little difference between the Afganistan and Africa. And equally little to do. There is no interior settings. Just two giant maps with repetitive outposts.
And you should be able to do more at Mother Base than target practice, shower, and look for diamonds. It's a huge area with nothing to do. Seems like Kojima didn't maximise this missed opportunity.
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Post by A.G. on Oct 31, 2015 11:00:19 GMT -5
In what way is MGS5 a must-play for casual fans and Metal Gear fans? Here is another great review. He actually already reviewed the game pointing out all the problems. But he went for 100% completion. And notice that he does praise the game but inevitably the review ends on a negative note. The game does get some things right. But the package as a whole... It's just not well put together. m.youtube.com/watch?v=hbVepJ5DbAI |
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Post by blackjaguar on Oct 31, 2015 13:58:17 GMT -5
To each their own, For me this game has delivered on giving me a fantastic open world stealth experience. It is a must have game for me as no other game series gives me the same excitement of Metal Gear, each base feels pretty well crafted to me, though I usually just play the mission areas I don't go too far about unless I'm in a jeep doing side ops with DDog
Don't get me wrong, I like MGS4 but feel its weapon system breaks the game and it still felt extremely linear which makes the freedoms of Phantom pain feel so much better to me.
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Post by edward18 on Oct 31, 2015 15:56:25 GMT -5
Well there are very clearly "classic" fanboys here, and they do, I feel, give Peace Walker and 5 an undeserved amount of hate. For me though, Peace Walker and 5 are still pretty...not good compared to anything before them. They're crap storywise, but when it comes to gamewise, Peace Walker's a much more enjoyable experience to me. 5 is just...really really bland. And a lot of it has to do with the setting. In the original games you have all these memorable settings. I'll always remember Zanzibarland and Shadow Moses and The Tanker. Heck, even 4 had memorable areas to an extent. Peace Walker constantly kept new stuff coming. But 5? It's just "here's deserty-foresty-area number 40.". And it's like that the whole game. The environment has no personality or distinctiveness to it. And part of that is because it's open world. I much more prefer having a set location that you get to have an impression of through backtracking and exploring over the course of the adventure.
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Cerberus_0408
Elite (level 2)
Now playing MGS HD Collection and wanting Metal Gear Legacy Collection
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Post by Cerberus_0408 on Oct 31, 2015 16:04:35 GMT -5
'Fantastic open world stealth experience?' Let me question this...
Game turns to sh!t after Mission 31... Why am I replaying chapter 1 missions on a harder setting? How is that main ops? And the few new missions that you actually get have nothing to do with the theme of the chapter, Race.
why am I forced to sit through the same helicopter scenes over and over? I can't skip them and they offer nothing useful.
Why can't I take the chopper to various points on the map like at Mother Base?
Most enemy outposts are damn near identical. Combined with an empty landscape it's simply boring.
Most main ops should be classified as side ops. Kill this guy... Rescue that guy... Destroy this vehicle... Retrieve that document. Pointless! Out 50 missions in the main ops only a handful actually move the story forward.
Boss fights... Where are they? Surely not the Skulls, lol. Spamming your weapons into ammo sponges. Some of the worst boss fights I've ever seen.
How do I start a new game? That's right, I can't. I have to erase my file and start over if I want to see most of the cutscenes.
Why does item development take so long? You acquire the funds but then have to wait additional time to develop the item? A lot of effort to acquire things, most of which isn't very useful.
There are MANY other points. It just pisses me off.
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