What is Metal Gear to you?

[A.G.]

There are a lot of differences between how people see the Metal Gear series. In general, everyone seems to be in agreement until the Big Shell part of MGS2. After that opinions go all over the place. Some feel MGS2 was a masterpiece, some think it was a massive fail. Many liked MGS3, but surprisingly I'm finding a lot that didn't. MGS4 is a mixed bag. Opinions on games made after MGS4 vary as well.

So what is the series to you?

For me it's MG1, MG2, MGS1, MGS2, MGS3, and MGS4. When looking at those 6 games the story feels complete and flows with minimal contradictions. Yes, there are some issues. MGS4 tries to explain too much. Some things just don't need to be explained. Not a fan of post-MGS4 games. Mainly because they end up doing more of the same type of damage that MGS4 did, explaining things that don't need to be explained. But at least MGS4 was the conclusion, so it could get away with most of what it did. MPW and MGS5 were not necessary.

One thing I always liked about MGS4 was how it addressed with the issue of fighting a Metal Gear. Every game needs this to happen, it's in the title. Rex was the ultimate weapon, Ray was the counter weapon. MGS3 was a prequel so the Shagohod worked well as a pre-Metal Gear. With MGS4 it was great to see that they didn't just cram another mecha in. The Gekko was a smart evolution and Rex vs Ray avoided adding a new machine and gave us a memorable dream match.

[fgdj2000]

I love about the series how it is (or was) constantly evolving and how each game was different from the other games, while still retaining the same feel overall. Also, I love that each game since MGS1 at least actually was about something and had a lot of philosophical stuff weaved into the narrative.
However, I have to admit, I felt MGSV somewhat broke the mold. It felt very different and I ha some issue with the portrayal of Quiet and the relative emptiness of the open world. I don't hate it and liked it for trying. I stand by my previous comments that gameplay wise the game is amazing and probably one of the best stealth games (if not the best) out there.

Also, I didn't really warm up to MGS4, but was surprised by MGS PW and found that game incredibly engaging for some reason. Also, I think the early MSX games are plagued by some flaws, especially the first game. A.I. is terrible, areas are unrealistic and the music, while fun at first, makes your eyes bleed. Still, I view it as a diamond in the rough and MG2 was the polished version.

So overall, MG - diamond in the rough. MG2, MGS, MGS2, MGS3, MGSPW are masterpieces imo (though MG2 has some weird stuff like the smoke grenade riddle and the egg riddle in it and MGS1 and MGS2 have some pacing issues). MGS4 tried to hard to tie everything in a neat knot and MGSV (I count both of them as one game) was a couragious attempt at something different, but ultimately, while it succeeded on many levels, it also has numerous flaws that keep it from achieving the level of greatness its predecessors had, in part due to its unfinished nature and also the way Quiet was portrayed. I'm not complaining about her outfit, but really some of those boob and ass shots and the way she shoved her butthole in your face at times were just kind of annoying... granted, I wouldn't have minded those when I was 15 but still it was annoying especially since apart from that she really is the most interesting character in the game.

[A.G.]

I'm with you on almost everything. Though not sure how MPW is a masterpiece. Weak cast, about the same level as MGS5, and a questionable story. The gameplay was a commendable effort given the system it was on, but I felt it was very limiting. A PSP game in 2010 just felt like a wasted effort.

[Cerberus_0408]

A PSP game in 2010 just felt like a wasted effort.

Well, then Kojima wasted all his effort with MPO as well, lmfao

[A.G.]

Dec 31, 2015 19:37:40 GMT -5 Cerberus_0408 said:

A PSP game in 2010 just felt like a wasted effort.

Well, then Kojima wasted all his effort with MPO as well, lmfao

That's a given. But at least that was in 2006. The PSP was still somewhat viable at that point. What's funny is I remember when Acid came out they claimed a full MGS was not possible on the PSP. Ironically, I think if they used Acid 2 graphics, MPW gameplay, and MPO story/cast in a stand-alone non-canon game it would've made a good 2006-7 release. Hell, maybe as a sequel or prequel to Ghost Babel. That was a great game. Good story, good cast... Took elements from MSX games and MGS1 as a non-canon sequel to MG1. An alternate timeline. I was hoping for something like that on the PSP.

[Cerberus_0408]

See, if Kojima had released PO on the PSP in 2006, why the fark couldn't he release PW on a proper bloody CONSOLE four years later? Why the bloody hell would he stick to using a portable device, given that said device has LESS buttons than a normal console? Thus, gamers would be PISSED at the mechanics. Now THAT's the part I just don't comprehend.

[A.G.]

Not to mention that the game sold poorly being released on a dying system. Let's face it, by 2010 the PSP was a joke.

[Cerberus_0408]

MGS should NEVER have been made for the farking PSP. A game like that is obviously meant for the consoles.

[A.G.]

Very true. Handhelds are not the best platform for a cinematic gaming experience.

[Cerberus_0408]

I don't get this part from Wikipedia.

MPO is the fourth Metal Gear title made specifically for the PSP...

Yeah, well Kojima should've invested in a title made 'specifically for a console that has more lasting popularity'.

The whole irony is, somehow 'Metal Gear Solid: Portable Ops received highly positive critical reception from critics, and is often viewed as one of the best games released for the PSP'. (again from Wikipedia)

[fgdj2000]

Don't know how this turned into a PSP bashing thread... however, keep in mind MGS is a Japanese game series and while the international makrket has grown in importance for Kojima and Konami over the years, I think it was still primarily developed with a Japanese audience in mind. And the PSP was actually pretty strong in Japan, like the Game Boy once was over here. So, making a PSP game in 2010 for Japanese audiences still made sence.

On MPW I guess we have to agree to disagree. I though most of the characters were pretty memorable (Paz, Chico & Amanda, Huey, Kaz, Snake of course) and some of them felt wuite fresh (especially child soldier Chico and Big Boss' interaction with him). The only real needless character was Cecile. I also felt the story was pretty good and unlike MPO not just a rehash of MGS1 plot points. Gameplay was also translated pretty great to the PSP, as almost veryne here seems to agree and graphics were almost PS2 level, just a little blockier. The only real downside was the missing difficulty setting imo, because the difficulty spike in the main mission just skyrockets at some point.

As for the other titles, I never had the patience for MGA and didn't care much for the story, though I appreciate the effort of doing something different. Same for MPO. I thought it had great ideas, but suffered from really pure execution. The plot was essentially a rehash of MGS1 to a large part just with Naked Snake instead of Solid Snake (Snake has to go against his former unit, which include a Psychic, a torture expert who also is a double agent, has to fight a Ninja who turns out to be Gray Fox and fight the main villain who has a similar connection to his father/motherfigure like Snake and views them as brothers and wants to complete the will of the former father/motherfigure, etc.). The gameplay was unpolished with clumpsy controls, tedious dragging around of enemy soldiers and arbitrary ways for guy to detect you, even though you're in disguise which leads to almost trial and error like sections of gameplay. The environments are serviable but really nothing worth mentioning and there is obviously a lot of filler missions even in the main story that also seems to stretch out the experience for far to long.
However, imo MPW ironed out most of these and can be considered to be one of the best games on the system.

@cerberus: they probably counted the Metal Gear Solid Digital Graphic Novel, which initially was released only on PSP a few months before MPO.

[Cerberus_0408]

On MPW I guess we have to agree to disagree.

Don't quite understand what this means.

I though most of the characters were pretty memorable (Paz, Chico & Amanda, Huey, Kaz, Snake of course) and some of them felt wuite fresh (especially child soldier Chico and Big Boss' interaction with him). The only real needless character was Cecile. I also felt the story was pretty good and unlike MPO not just a rehash of MGS1 plot points. Gameplay was also translated pretty great to the PSP, as almost veryne here seems to agree and graphics were almost PS2 level, just a little blockier. The only real downside was the missing difficulty setting imo, because the difficulty spike in the main mission just skyrockets at some point.

Agree with most of this in general, though I still feel PW throws out the original trilogy and renders them useless in terms of plot. Gameplay-wise I like capturing enemy vehicles for your own use. Something that makes it UNLIKE usual MG or MGS games.

As for difficulty levels, you get warned of how hard it is with the skull ratings.

As for the other titles, I never had the patience for MGA

Not too sure what MGA means.

@cerberus: they probably counted the Metal Gear Solid Digital Graphic Novel, which initially was released only on PSP a few months before MPO.

Speaking of the 'graphic novel', how the hell can I get it? I mean, is it available on the PSN or Xbox live or somesuch?

[A.G.]

It's part of the Legacy Colletion.

[fgdj2000]

@cerberus:
MGA is short for Metal Gear Acid. The turn-based card games that were releaed for PSP in 04 and 05.

What do you mean by the original trilogy? Metal Gear 1 and 2 for MSX and Metal Gear Solid 1?

[Cerberus_0408]

Yeah. Trilogy meant the first 2 games and MGS1.